#127 "Letting" Other People Feel Their Feelings with Jon Parsons, MD

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Hey, this is Melissa Parsons, and you are listening to the Your Favorite You Podcast. I'm a certified life coach with an advanced certification in deep dive coaching. The purpose of this podcast is to help brilliant women like you with beautiful brains create the life you've been dreaming of with intentions. My goal is to help you find your favorite version of you by teaching you how to treat yourself as your own best friend.

If this sounds incredible to you and you want practical tips on changing up how you treat yourself, then you're in the right place. Just so you know, I'm a huge fan of using all of the words available to me in the English language, so please proceed with caution if young ears are around.

Melissa 

Hello everyone, welcome back to Your Favorite You. I have a guest on who I've actually stopped counting how many times he's been a guest because it's way past a three-peat and he is here because we were talking this weekend about letting each other feel our feelings without having to intervene and try to fix and make things better. And I thought this would be a great topic to talk about for the podcast. So welcome back to the one and only, Jonathan Phillip Parsons. 

Jon 

Hi everybody, great to be back. 

Melissa 

Tell us, since you've been on the podcast last, Dr. Parsons, has anything changed about your favorite you? 

Jon 

I don't know if anything's changed. I still, as you very well know, working with my coach, trying to refine and, you know, identify things that I can potentially improve on or work work through that that come up, and which is, it's interesting, like when I time goes by when I don't meet with Jess, I don't recognize it immediately. But then I feel almost like I haven't gone to the gym in a while, you just feel like that muscle memory of working with someone that has made such a big difference in your life. So I guess I would say, I am still working through the tension of being a human being versus a human doing. 

Melissa 

Hmm 

Jon 

And when I get really busy at work, just trying to avoid getting into the rut of crossing the next thing off a list that I have to get done versus taking time to experience what's happening around me is probably still my biggest opportunity. 

Melissa 

Mmm, I love it. Do you want to speak a little bit to why you and most of us as humans revert back to being a human doing instead of a human being? Why do you think it's so easy for you to revert back to it? 

Jon 

Well, for me, you know, a lot of my job is, is getting shit done, you know, executing projects, executing strategic planning, you know, deliverables for people that I, that are my bosses, and that intuitively really is checking things off the list that you have to get done. And those never end, that list never is miles long. So you can easily get yourself into the run of just continue on to the next thing and to sort of get, you know, your place in the universe that happens to me pretty easily. 

Melissa 

Mm hmm. I'm wondering if you could speak to why your brain tells you that it's safer to be a human doing than it is to be a human being. 

Jon 

Oh, that's easy for me. It's because I get external validation from getting shit done for other people.You know, when I produce, I get feedback that I'm doing good things. And when you're being a human being and just sort of existing and experiencing, it's all your feedback is internal. 

Melissa 

So good. I love that you know this about yourself. 

Jon 

Well, it's many, many years of the coaching journey, some paid, some unpaid, so. 

Melissa 

Are you saying that I've offered you unsolicited coaching? 

Jon 

Never. I have a daily contract with that with you. That's correct. 

Melissa 

Oh my goodness. Okay. So thank you for sharing that. I think that'll help a lot of people to maybe see some of themselves in you because of course, as you know, most of my clients, and I think probably most of my listeners are type A successful women who have, like you said, gotten shit done for a long time. And it has worked out well for them. And you know, the idea of relaxing back into being a human being is a little bit scary at first because they wonder where they're going to get their validation from. And if it counts, if it's just getting it from yourself rather than all the other people that you care about and whose opinions you actually do want to be high of you. So thanks for sharing that.

Okay. So let's get into what we were talking about this weekend a little bit. I mean, I, we started talking about it and I was like, zip, zip, zip it. Like let's save it for the podcast. So we didn't really get a chance to get into it too deeply, but I will say that in the past I have been annoyed at you when I feel like I'm going through something. I don't really know what it is. It's causing me to not be my normal, chipper, happy, easy going self. And you because you love me, I think trying to like make it go away, trying to fix it for me so that I can feel better. And then I think in turn so that you can feel better. And I recognized it this weekend because you are going through a little bit of a rut. I think it's safe to say and have been more sad than usual. And it made me very uncomfortable. And I was like, oh no, I need to do something to fix this. Like let's make this go away real quick so that we can enjoy our weekend. And I recognized it. I will give myself a pat on the back and some props because I did recognize it right away. And I was like, oh shit, I'm doing to him what annoys me when he does it to me. So can we talk a little bit about, and maybe I've already said too much, but why do you think that for you it's uncomfortable to see me not be my favorite version of me? 

Jon 

Well, that was a long question. 

Melissa 

Well, at least I didn't do it in my Howard Cosell voice. 

Jon 

Anyway, these inside jokes are not gonna resonate. Yeah, I mean, I think the reality is that when you're not feeling on your A-game, I'm talking about myself, watching someone else around you who you rely upon to be the rock, to be the put-together person or the strong person is anxiety-provoking when you don't have your own shit together. And so it's easy to try to figure out how can I fix her problem quickly so I can go back to trying to fix the problems that I have that I can never fucking fix. So that's my mentality is when I see you, I got enough shit going on for myself. I don't have time for you to be going through with what you're going through. So let's figure out how we fix your shit so we can go back to mine that is seemingly unfixable for forever.

It's funny because this comes up a lot with Jess, my coach, where sort of she doesn't get annoyed with me, but I can feel like if I were married to her, how she would be annoyed with me about, just let her be, let her fucking be herself. Like let her be her, go through it. That's part of the deal. And I probably honestly struggle with this less with you now than I do with the boys. 

It's really hard for me to watch them have to navigate through any kind of speed bumps and just sit and I do it. But it's hard for me just to sit on the sidelines and it's like, you got to fucking figure this out. 

Melissa 

Mm hmm. Yeah, I mean, I think there's a balance between. 

Jon 

They're adults now, honey. I mean, they're, I mean, it's not like we're taking care of them. So they don't hurt themselves, like when they're a toddler. I mean, right? These are adult men that need to figure out what their life's going to be like. 

Melissa 

Yeah, but I mean, I think from my perspective, like, yeah, maybe they're not going to hurt themselves physically like they would when they would fall or fight or, you know, do WWE moves on our bed. But for me, it's like, oh, but like, these are emotional things that.

Jon 

Yeah, but the emotional things are the ones that shape your experience in life. That's what it's, and then that's the thing I can, I always forget sometimes, or I struggle with and, and the other thing, just going back to the original kind of like, yeah, I'm in a little bit of a rut right now.There's a lot going on at work that the work's going great, but it's overwhelming, the volume of shit going on. We're in a difficult place to be in an academic institution where government funding for grants and research is in limbo. We have a healthcare leader now in the federal government that is not, you know, subscribed to any kind of evidence-based medicine. This vice president is an alum of the university that I work at. It's a tough culture to work in. And then people are looking to me to be the voice of reason and confidence and everything's going to be okay. I'm like, I don't fucking know if everything's going to be okay or not. 

Melissa 

Yeah, you want to scream into the abyss as well. 

Jon 

But I got to make sure I got to put the good juju out to them too. And that's all I can continue to do is to put out the good juju that keep being a good human being and an empathetic teammate to your work teams.And this, we'll get through this together. That's a hard, you know, responsibility to, to absorb. 

Melissa 

Mm hmm. Well, a hard sell too, in this current environment. Yeah, I feel you. I mean, I know that you're not alone in struggling with a lot of these things. So thank you for sharing that.

And to get back to the boys, like what I think and I haven't shared this with you because I just saw it a couple of days ago. But the idea, you know, we've all heard of like helicopter parents and lawnmower parents and that type of thing. We definitely are not those. But I do think as they come into young adulthood, where you're more of a mentor and a guide to them, then you are a parent. You know, it is important, especially in- from my perspective and our relationship with them, that they do see us as what I'm going to call lighthouse parents, where they know that we're there, even if it's foggy, the storms are rolling through like the lighthouse is there. We're not going we're not going anywhere. We're there to support them in any way that they need. And, you know, it may just be listening to them vent without having to try to fix. 

Jon 

you are the brightest lighthouse in central Ohio. A landlocked community of 2 million people. 

Melissa 

Oh my god, too good. No, seriously. 

Jon 

No, we already have that. I mean, I think that is an awesome thing that somehow we've managed together to produce that culture in our family. Despite all the dysfunction that we perceive that we have, we've managed to raise two boys that have that relationship with their parents. They know that we don't have to tell them. They know we've always got their back, but we're not going to do it for them. And it's a difficult balance to strike, but it's just still sometimes it's hard to watch them. But that's just the way it is. So it's just a narrative I have in my head all a lot, you know, I could just swoop in, I could buy this for them, I could do that. I mean, no, they got to figure it out. And it's got to remind myself, you know,

Melissa 

Mm-hmm. I think I've shared this recently on the podcast, and I might have already told you about it too, but I think it bears repeating. Apparently, I heard Martha Beck talking about this, where they did an experiment where they were raising trees in a perfect environment. It was like a dome terrarium, for lack of a better term, and they had the exact amount of sunlight, the exact amount of rain, the exact nutrients that they needed, and all the trees died. And what they didn't account for was the need for wind to make it so that the trees would grow strong in deep roots.And I think that in the case of the kids, and really even in the case of each other, the struggle and the hardships and that type of thing really are the things that make you strong. And in terms of relationships too, a lot of my clients will be upset that they have had an argument and a blow-up with their kids or with their spouse or with somebody that they care about. And I have to constantly remind them that healthy relationships are not all about just an upward trajectory of everyone getting along all the time, that there is rupture and repair that has to happen in order for the person to grow strong roots, or for the relationship to to be strong and to have a strong bond. So I don't know what the tree with the deepest roots is, we should look that up. But I think we're pretty mighty oaks around here. 

Jon 

Agree, but even that's all true. But even the process of rupture is painful and difficult to witness.And so something you said there also made me think about when I gave you the answer of why I try to fix your shit for you. And my answer sounded very self centered, like because I don't have time for your shit because I got my own. 

Melissa 

I mean, that's really why we do anything because we want to be able to get back to taking care of ourselves. 

Jon 

But it's also because I love you and because I don't want you to have to have shit. And so that's sort of a positive virtuous cycle of me trying to, that's sort of what I do for, I got my DNA as a human being is trying to help people not have to suffer or, you know, as a physician but also as a leader, help people be successful. Well, you know, when my wife is struggling with something and she can't fucking tell me why it is, that causes me to have hypertension. She can't tell me. Two days later. So remember that time, like last Saturday where I was frustrated at two o'clock? It's because I'm like, why the hell couldn't you just fricking tell me that? 

Melissa 

Yeah. Because sometimes it takes me a while to process and to figure it out. And, you know, just as well as I do that, you know, sometimes it's something that you don't even recognize at the time going on. And, you know, when you're willing to do the self-inquiry and you're willing to, you know, question your thoughts and question all the beliefs that you've had and that type of thing, sometimes that takes time. And, of course, we're in a society now where everyone expects everything to be instantaneous. And, you know, that's just not realistic. That's back to the human doing versus the human being way of life. Any other insights that you want to share? 

Jon 

I guess would also say that I don't know where I read this, but I think I said this to the other day where, you know, you get into this sort of pattern of trying to the more you have them, the stuff you have, you want more, you know, you want the haves and you just want to accumulate more and you want to do more, be more successful. And then I read this somewhere where like, the real true fulfillment in your life is like the ratio of your haves to your wants. And there's two ways to have a high fulfillment ratio. You have a very small denominator, a very high numerator. But the reality is that the more haves you have, they typically want a lot more too. And then that ratio doesn't really change much. But the true secret sauce to fulfillment is not wanting very much, you know, you want to, you want your health, you want your family, you want, you know, a good mindset. That's probably enough. And I think we both sometimes struggle with what do we really want? Do we really need that mostly around how much money do we have to spend on this shit? 

Melissa 

Well, because we both love to travel. 

Jon 

Uh-huh. 

Melissa 

And I like to update things. 

Jon 

And it's all true. 

Melissa 

So, yeah, I think that's so interesting, right? I was just talking to one of my coaches, one of my business coaches about this and the idea of, and I think we're talking about similar things, contentment. Like, you know, sometimes you think that, you know, you hear contentment and you think it's like the death knell of any growth or any movement forward in life and that type of thing. And I think we have reached the stage in life, at least from my perspective, that contentment is where it's at. And I think what you're saying about the haves versus the wants, you know, we already have everything that we could possibly need and then some. 

Jon 

So right. And when you're on social media, and you see all this other stuff, and you see all the opportunities to want things that other people perceive that they have, just creates a difficult mind. That's all for me sometimes to like, do I need that? That'll be awesome. If I have that, do I really- I mean, you start questioning like, do I have enough? Is what I have is, is it a good amount? And then when you step back, like, I don't really need, I got what I need. Do I need a bigger circle of friends? No. I'm just being honest. Like, I'm no, I'm good. Thanks. I'm good. 

Melissa 

When our friend Greg came down this weekend, he was supposed to come down next weekend, but some plans changed on his end. And he messaged the day before saying, hey, do you and Jon have any plans on Saturday? I was in a surprise twist we all saw coming. Jon and I have zero plans for the weekend. 

Jon 

And yeah, because I'm content, I see these reels and these stuff on online, like these people that go out to dinner after eight o'clock, what freaking planet are you on? Or like, no, I'm not interested in going to a mixer or to meet people I don't know. No, I'm not interested in any of that shit because I've got what I want and I'm satisfied with. And there are some people that are wired differently, but you got to figure out what that ratio of your half the wants is and then really think about it. The other thing I was going to tell you that I thought of, I talked to Jess about last time we had a session. You know what annoys me?

Melissa 

No, I can't wait. 

Jon 

It annoys me that I have to work at having a well framed mindset, that I can't just think through this and then balance myself. No, I have to constantly, like, breathe, sand the deck or like, it's constant maintenance. And I told her that the other day. Like, why, like, why do I continually have to do all this work to, you know, frame my mind? And we talked through it a little bit. And, you know, I sort of answer my own question, like, it's like going to the gym, like, you get yourself in really good shape. But if you don't keep going, you know, eventually, have some regression in terms of your fitness. Yeah, creeps back to me, they just know it annoys me that I, for whatever reason, I have to constantly do work to, to refine my thinking. 

Melissa 

Yeah, it's not easy work, but I think what we forget sometimes is that the way that we were living before we were managing our mindset was hard too. 

Jon 

Yeah, that's right. But when you're in it yourself, you don't, it's very hard to have that level of clarity and you're thinking too, it's only in retrospect. 

Melissa 

Yeah, it'd be nice if it was a one and done situation, and you could check it off the box and be like, mindset, done. I don't think that's how it works, as you have so eloquently put it, which I think you could either look at that–unsolicited coaching coming–and be annoyed, or you could look at it and say, this is the best news ever, I know how to do this. Like, it's not a matter of me not knowing how, it's not a matter of me not knowing how to go and do a full body workout, I know how to do it. It's just a matter of, you know, sometimes the hardest step for anything like a workout is just putting your shoes on and going out the door. 

Jon 

Exactly. And same thing. I mean, you have to be willing to do the work and recognize that, yes, I need to go to the gym or need to go down on the treadmill or your peloton or whatever, lift weights. You have to get yourself out of bed and go do it.Same thing in the thought process, in the mindset, in the approach to who you are and where you are in the universe. That's not a passive experience for me. That's an active experience. And what I've found is unless I actively decide that I'm going to do this and carve out the time, it's not very much to do the work, I notice when I don't. 

Melissa 

Yeah, I mean, let's be honest, you have a choice, you could stop doing it. 

Jon 

Well, I want to be happy, healthy, and married. So those are choices I can’t… I mean, I don't want to be sad, dead, or in pieces along I-270, so I choose to do coaching. 

Melissa 

I mean, all joking aside, like I think a lot of my people experience this same thing and I'll never forget. I was so excited to go to my last coaching call in my first group coaching experience with Dr. Ubel. I thought she was going to like give us the roadmap to like to be amazing. And like I was like, I even scheduled it when Jack and I were at Ohio University doing a tour. I was like, I have to take this call at two o'clock. I thought she was going to like give us the prescription and like have us be able to check off the box and like, okay, you're done. You've graduated. And at the end she was like, yeah, you just got to keep doing what you've been doing. I was like, oh, fuck. And, you know, any of us could choose to do that, but I haven't, I personally have not met. I'm sure that there are people, but I personally have not met and I certainly have never coached anyone who was like, I don't want to do this anymore. I want to go back to my old way of being and forget everything that I've learned here. You know, most of them are like, you couldn't pry it from my dead cold hands. 

Jon 

Couldn’t agree more. Only caveat is that there are people do perceive that people are able to execute that mission without a lot of work or effort. That's something that comes to people easy. And it's just the reality and the admission and the acceptance that, you know, that you're going to have to do work at this, and that's just the way it is for the rest of your life. Lifetime contract. 

Melissa 

And like I said, like you could choose to go back and do it the other way and nobody does. 

Jon 

No, because I feel better. 

Melissa 

Yeah. And that's what it's all about. And that's why when we're trying to change each other's mindset about things and I see you sad and I want you to stop being sad, it's so that I can feel better. Like I have…

Jon 

What are we gonna do with you? Quote on quote on said. What are we gonna do with you was the quote. Yeah. 

Melissa 

Oh God, it's a good thing I have a coaching call with Maggie tomorrow. We can work through it. 

Jon 

Said that in a loving way. It wasn't like that was for show, but you did say those exact words. But it was in like, Oh, what are we going to do with you? You pathetic soul. 

Melissa 

Oh, I'm so glad I picked up on it right away. And I was like, oh, you want to come on the podcast and talk about it? I'm glad we got to work it out here, babe. All right. Is there anything else you want to say? 

Jon 

No, I think we had a little potpourri for the listeners today. 

Melissa 

Yeah. If anybody has any questions that they want Jon and me to answer, we would be happy to come back on and answer our listener questions. So if you have questions or you're like, I don't know what you're talking about, or that doesn't make sense, please don't hesitate. You can email me, Melissa at MelissaParsonsCoaching.com. And I'm sure Jon would love to answer some listener questions if they come in. So that might be coming to a future episode near you. 

Jon 

Oh, a mail back. I can't wait. Thanks, babe. That would be amazing. 

Melissa 

Thanks for coming. I love you too. Have a good day. Bye everybody. Come back next week.

Hey - It’s still me. Since you are listening to this podcast, you very likely have followed all the rules and ticked off all the boxes but you still feel like something's missing! If you're ready to learn the skills and gain the tools you need to tiptoe into putting yourself first and treating yourself as you would your own best friend, I'm here to support you. As a general life coach for women, I provide a safe space, compassionate guidance, and practical tools to help you navigate life's challenges as you start to get to know and embrace your authentic self.

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You're ready to invest in yourself and embark on this journey, so head over to melissaparsonscoaching.com, go to the work with me page, and book a consultation call. We can chat about all the support I can provide you with as we work together.

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